Lauren Bacall

Lauren Bacall Good as he ordered them 10 at a time.

Sandra McGrath That's right. I drop them off. I have them in the back of the car each time you want.

Lauren Bacall If you need any copies for anything, I have them too, of course.

Sandra McGrath I actually read the book when I was in New York in January, never dreaming I should ever meet you.

Lauren Bacall Oh, this year? In New York?

Sandra McGrath Yes. I have a friend actually who lives in in your building who you might know called Pauline Pinto. Have you ever run into her?

Lauren Bacall In the Dakota? Pauline Pinto? Oh, Joe and—

Sandra McGrath They're divorced now, but—

Lauren Bacall Pauline and Joe Pinto have been living in the Dakota for years. What's she look like?

Sandra McGrath She's got long blonde hair, and probably is in jeans most of the time.

Lauren Bacall It's open. Why is this room left open like this? The maid leaves, and she leaves the door— Now, at lunchtime, they'll tell you. I don't understand that. My God, those are beautiful gladiolas, aren't they?

Sandra McGrath They're just gorgeous.

Lauren Bacall I mean they really— I mean they really are.

Sandra McGrath A breath of spring.

Lauren Bacall Yes, a breath of— I don't know what.

Sandra McGrath Where did they come from?

Lauren Bacall Sit down, won't you? Would you like something?

Sandra McGrath No, no, thank you. I've never been in one of these. It's the first nice room I've seen in this place.

Lauren Bacall Very nice.

Sandra McGrath It's very good this. What do you think about our strike-ridden country, which is almost all in chaos?

Lauren Bacall Well, I mean the suspense is killing. To what's going to happen. I'll be right with you.

Sandra McGrath Right, sure.

Lauren Bacall I always forget the machine, they never work either, these machines.

Sandra McGrath What was, er, how— how did it mean, how did it work out? It's a tape show, it's not a live show.

Lauren Bacall No, it's live.

Sandra McGrath A live show at 12:00?

Lauren Bacall Yeah.

Sandra McGrath Really? Did you enjoy your Mike Walsh Show, I hear?

Lauren Bacall Yeah. Well you know, I think it's, I'll get used to it. As you get to know someone a little bit better, you know, it gets easier. It all becomes much— I mean, you become really keen to sit and talk to someone. It becomes much friendlier operation, much easier.

Sandra McGrath You like a little peanut?

Lauren Bacall Peanut?

Sandra McGrath Look at these, aren't they fascinating? From Taiwan.

Lauren Bacall Mmm, tiny little shell.

Sandra McGrath Listen, can we just talk a bit about— I hope they take care of your tickets. I'm sorry they were—

Lauren Bacall No. No. Um, talk about what?

Sandra McGrath Anything.

Lauren Bacall Anything, anything.

Sandra McGrath I want to know just a bit about New York life. What you do, who you see.

Lauren Bacall Oh.

Sandra McGrath Why you live there instead of California.

Lauren Bacall Well, I haven't lived in California since 1950— 58. That's January '59, I left. That's 20 years ago. I had no reason to live there. I mean, I had my life there, and I really felt that I had kind of a beginning, a middle, and an end. I had a complete life there, and I I think it's no place for a woman alone to be, anyway.

Sandra McGrath California?

Lauren Bacall California.

Sandra McGrath Most people say New York isn't.

Lauren Bacall There's so much that's interesting in New York. There's so much more to do. There's so much more to see. I mean, if you're an actress, and if you're in the film world in California, it's you kind of are apt to fall into a pattern of seeing the same people. And it's also, I mean you see the same people anywhere, but but uh they become very um it's always, "Oh, what are you doing next?" or "What did you—" I mean it's is an overconcentration on one thing. As opposed to, I mean in New York, although I'm in the theater, and a lot of my friends are in the theater, there are one has many, many more interests.

Sandra McGrath What are your interests outside of the theater?

Lauren Bacall Well, I love to go to ballet, concerts to go to all the time, ballet to go to all the time. There's always something happening in New York.

Sandra McGrath What's your favorite restaurant?

Lauren Bacall Um, I guess my favorite restaurant is, um, uh, my favorite food really is Chinese food.

Sandra McGrath Which one do you go to?

Lauren Bacall I— I go to Pearl's a lot. I I don't I really hate to go to restaurants, I have to tell you. I don't go to them much. Uh, I will go to Pearl's for Chinese food because I love Chinese food.

Sandra McGrath Is Pearl's P-E-A-R-L-S?

Lauren Bacall Yes. Uh, and I go to Elaine's. I mean, not for the food, but I go to Elaine's for the whole, for Elaine and the whole feeling of Elaine's. Um, and a lot of my friends go there, and we, you know, we go there together.

Sandra McGrath Who are the friends you still see?

Lauren Bacall Well, my closest, uh, I suppose the woman I feel closest to is probably Phyllis Newman, who's married to Adolph Green. And Mary Stone, who's married to Peter Stone. I guess they're my two closest friends in New York that I see frequently, a lot. Um, and I see, uh, I mean Betty Comden and her husband a lot. I mean, there are fit friends I've had for a long time. And Arthur Hornblow is a very good friend of mine. I'm trying to think of the people that I see most, you know. Uh, Katie Hepburn, of course, is a very old friend of mine, but I see, you know, she moves around and I move around, but we keep— You know, I I keep a constant check on Kate, just to check in with her, see if she's okay, and, you know, just to say hello, and she is, you know, she just says hello and she's wonderful.

Sandra McGrath Is she working now?

Lauren Bacall Not that I know of, but I mean I haven't really been around so much that I really can't say. She just finished this She finished that The Corn Is Green, but I I didn't see. I was I was in Florida, I guess, making the making the Allum film then. I see, um, I mean, I find that I I mean, I always seem to have this nucleus of friends, you know, that I see in New York. And, um, and I go to the theater a lot, I mean when there's something to see, and I have a lot of friends in the theater.

Sandra McGrath What do you think of the New York theater state of the New York theater?

Lauren Bacall Well, at the moment, at the moment as far as the audiences are concerned, uh, we have I guess there are there are more people going to the theater this year than they have in years.

Sandra McGrath What about the plays?

Lauren Bacall Uh, we, unhappily, do not have a lot of uh producing playwrights at the moment. Uh, we have not had anywhere near as many original plays as I would love to see. Uh, a lot of our our theater is is it comes from England, or at least a good part of it does. We have, uh, our musical theater, of course, is very much our own, which is it's wonderful. But I mean they can't be that many marvelous musicals. Of course Steve Sondheim, Hal Prince together create the best musicals, and I mean they can't do five a year. They do one every couple of years or whatever. Um,

Sandra McGrath You consider straight plays, do you think British playwriting—

Lauren Bacall I don't know anything about that. No, not at all.

Sandra McGrath Off Off-Broadway very good?

Lauren Bacall I I don't, I'm I'm totally unfamiliar with it. I I I know when I was in England, when I lived in England for a couple of years, I mean, there's I love Stoppard, Peter Nichols. They've got some wonderful playwrights there. But they really do write for English actors. They don't write for Americans. Well, they're English, why should they write for Americans? Uh, and hopefully, uh, we have a couple of—

Sandra McGrath You don't think that an English— I'm sorry, do you do you think that an American actress can act in an English play?

Lauren Bacall Well, I think we can, but I think if if you're supposed to be English, I mean, you're far better to get an English actress. Right? They're not going to give parts to uh ape actors. And also, Equity has rules. And you forget, how can you forget about the unions? Ha, forget it! by the public at large, I have never had so much attention as I've had since the book. That was, no, that was all— uh it was different. I mean, I had attention when I first went into films as a new discovery, um and that was excitement, and that was all connected with the one thing. And then, of course, my whole romance with Bogie and marriage, that— that was that kind of attention. And applause was theatre accomplishment. But this seems to be more. Uh this obviously has reached more people, it seems. Uh I mean, I noticed when I uh I I'm I was just in France for the French uh publication of my book. And I noticed when I went to restaurants that I always go to when I'm in France, uh the ladies that that mind the ladies' loo, and that cigarette girls, whatev— I mean, that that know me, that have seen me before, never paid very much attention to me. And this trip, they kind— they talked to me, you know, as though they really knew me.

Sandra McGrath Do you think that the celluloid image went away and made you into a three-dimensional person for people?

Lauren Bacall Maybe, maybe. Uh I don't know, but it seems to have uh it's I I mean, I it's it seems to have made more of an impression, and uh there has been a greater connection somehow through the book. Uh and I I mean, I have I have been recognized before when I go any place, you know, but it's uh been compounded, I think, since the book.

Sandra McGrath Do you think it's a sort of rather nice comment on people that you...

Lauren Bacall Well, it's terrific, because I think that people have um I suppose they feel they know me better, um and they do. They do, they do. It is, it is uh

Sandra McGrath Does that have a dis— Does that worry you that this that When you set out to do the book, did you say, "All right, I'm not going to do it unless I am completely honest with what I think"? Did you...

Lauren Bacall Well, I knew that I would only do it that way. I mean, I've been asked for years to write a book. Uh I've been asked to write it with people. I've been asked to write about uh Hollywood. I've been asked to write about Bogie. I've been asked to write books about my opinions of of almost anything. And, of course, I never felt that anyone gave a damn what my opinions were, so I And I would never have written a book just about my life with Bogie or Hollywood or It did not interest me, and I certainly would never have written it with anyone. I have never felt that that an autobiography should be written by anyone else other than the person whose life it is. And I have never seen the point to it if you don't tell the truth. I don't see the point to much if you don't tell the truth. I mean, I like to I like to know where I am, and I like to know where other people are. And I believe in telling the truth. So, I mean, I knew that that when I did it—and I did it because Bob Gottlieb was the first person that said he wanted to know my whole life.

Sandra McGrath Is he the publisher?

Lauren Bacall The publisher and editor. He's head of Knopf in New York. And he he said he wanted me to write my whole life. He wanted to know why I survived, where, instead of ending up a drunk in the gutter, or God knows where, depending upon, you know, I, because my career has been very up and down. And I don't know. I mean, I suppose

Sandra McGrath What's the answer to that? The book sort of answers it towards the end.

Lauren Bacall Yeah, the answer to what? I don't know.

Sandra McGrath Why why you survived? What makes a survivor? In other words, what makes a survivor?

Lauren Bacall Well, I I mean, I think really what I started out in life with, which is what my mother gave me, what my family gave me. I think I had a core, a sense of what was right and wrong, and of what was important and what wasn't. Um I think my I started off life with very clear values. Um and I think I and I got that from my mother and my grandmother and my uncle. I think when you start out with that, when that's laid in very strong, you never forget that. You don't ever lose that. And then, of course,

Sandra McGrath Character. Excuse me? Character.

Lauren Bacall Well, I hope so. But I I uh I think that that that is the reason I've probably had the strength to cope with a lot of things in my life that maybe I would I would not have been able to cope with if I hadn't had that inner strength. Uh and then, of course, Bogie just added to that, because he, his feeling about character and behavior was certainly every bit as strong as my mother's was, so that I had it for many years drummed into me. It's hard to lose that, and I don't want to lose it. But you don't ever forget that, you see. And I had I had such a close relationship with my mother that I always, I mean, if I did anything wrong, I'd just look at her and my conscience was right there. I could see. I mean, I knew when I I knew when I was wrong. God knows I've been wrong in my life. Um I think that really is the reason that that I've been able to deal with a lot of uh negative things that have happened.

Sandra McGrath Of course, to the outside world your life would seem totally charmed. I mean, you can't be you know, when I read that book, one would have no idea that you've been through such uh traumatic times.

Lauren Bacall Yeah. Well, I mean, I have been very lucky in some areas, certainly I have. And at some periods of my life. My career has been very up and down, and very in and out. Um I had I had uh very high highs and very low lows. And that was And I had a lot I had many periods when I couldn't get a job. I mean, I couldn't get a decent job. You could get lousy jobs, there were always those available. Um and also when people don't really they don't really think you're very good, you know, or they don't think about you at all. I mean, that happens in that happened a lot in California. And actually, since the book, I mean, even in California they look at me differently. Cuz I suddenly am uh Now maybe it's just the time, you know, maybe you just have to live a certain length of time and go through whatever you have to go through in life, which I suppose we all do. And suddenly uh they look at you with different eyes. I mean, I'm the same person I was a year ago. But to an awful lot of people, I'm suddenly I've been rediscovered. I'm not complaining, though. It's wonderful. Yeah, but it has not been the case. I mean, my name has always been uh in the public eye. I have al- I mean, my name is in the newspapers, God knows, more often than I would like it to be a lot of the time. And that's luck. I don't know why that's happened. I mean, I've never had press agents and I don't you know, I don't live like that, so I don't I It hasn't been anything that I've done consciously. So I think maybe that's just my good fortune. Uh but now it's now it is I mean, I am very firmly established, it seems. And I just uh I hope that I will have more work offers, and I mean I have had, but that's been coincidentally, oddly enough, because the the Altman film was on the fire before the book ever came out. I knew that I was going to do that, and uh H.E.A.L.T.H. H.E.A.L.T.H. Uh the film I'm going to do next, with Stigwood, uh is uh I mean, he's wanted me to do it ever since he owned it, which is uh the last couple of years, The Fan. So that that, I mean, that just happened to come out, you know, all all of it's happening at the same time, but it's Those two things are not the result of the book. But it just see- I mean, I I mean, my publisher thought that the book would do well, but they had no idea it would do this well, this time. I certainly didn't have any idea it would do that well. I did You know, you just don't know what to expect.

Sandra McGrath Well deserved win. Very deserved.

Lauren Bacall Oh, thank you. I I'm I'm I'm very happy with the success of it, and I'm I'm surprised, but very happy that that many people are interested. I've gotten some wonderful letters. And and what pleases me a lot is that I've gotten a lot of letters from people who not only have understood and appreciated my relationship with my mother, but who also, because of of what I wrote about my mother, have made their attitudes change toward their mothers. Which is kind of nice, you know. Yeah, and it's it's uh That's rewarding. It is, it's uh Because I don't feel, you see, that during my mother's lifetime I really ever made her feel as much as I would have liked to.

Sandra McGrath I don't think anyone ever feels that until they're both... Excuse me. Did that through? What was for?

Lauren Bacall I I I kind of said so-so. Sorry, what was that? Yes.

Sandra McGrath It sounded like an inconclusive conversation.

Lauren Bacall That was what I couldn't understand, was that normally that they order for this, we have to eat while we're...

Sandra McGrath On the run.

Lauren Bacall Yeah, while we're talking. Um no, it's true, you don't ever. You always say, "If only I'd done this," or "If only I'd done that."

Sandra McGrath "If I'd only told them."

Lauren Bacall I know it, I know it. It's really, life is always like that. Not a damn thing you can do about it. We're all, everyone— I mean, my kids will have to find out. You know, everyone does.

Sandra McGrath Listen, the most I think I can't think of really, the death scenes in the book are really heartbreaking. I don't know how you could even bring yourself somehow to recall them, or give them It's so poignant.

Lauren Bacall But you don't ever forget that, you see. I mean, it's so vivid you can't forget it. And, you see, it because Well, it's been a very strange pattern. I I realized that I suddenly was I had always had to tell my mother about deaths in her family. You know, her mother and her brother and I suddenly realized that I was the one that was always breaking the news to her. Yeah, so weird that that happens to you in life, isn't it? And there is a that that was a pattern in my life. And uh God knows it's not an easy thing to do. No. Well, I mean, I'd al- I'd always known that it was a pattern. I had always thought that it was a very curious thing that I had told my mother, that I had been the one who had to tell her about her mother's death, about both her brothers. I always found that kind of weird. I always felt it was weird. It was weird. And, you know, you always think, "Oh, there must be a reason for this. There's usually a reason for everything." Well, the hell there is! Sometimes there's no reason for anything. It just happens. Um but, I mean, I didn't set out to say, "Well, I'm going to put this down and that down," and you know, I just I really tried to just get it down on paper, just as I remembered.

Sandra McGrath Did you do many drafts?

Lauren Bacall No, I overwrote to an incredible degree, detail, really. Um and my I worried about that. I asked Gottlieb about it, and he said, "Don't worry about it. That's my job. I'm the editor. You just get it down on paper." And uh so then I stopped worrying about it, and I I had to um not Well, I guess I rewrote certain After I'd finished the book, then he went through it, and cuz, you know, I mean you have no perspective, of course. And and then he told me what he felt needed fleshing out. And then if I agreed with him, I said, "All right," and otherwise I said, "That's..." You know, whatever, back and forth. And he is he's tremendously sensitive and uh smart and receptive man, and was really tremendously helpful. I don't think I could have done it with anyone else. And then I I I I I didn't rewrite the whole book, but I just added certain things to various sections of the book, or or rewrote it, reconstructed some of it. There were some areas that I felt There was some areas that I felt were lacking, but not a lot. I mean, it was more repetition that was cut out than anything. 'Cause I mean you can't write as many words as I wrote without repeating yourself! [laughs] I mean I wrote endless... endless, almost 1500 pages, longhand! You didn't even know what the hell I was writing after a while, you know, you get...

Sandra McGrath Did you write all day? Did you have a routine where you wrote all day?

Lauren Bacall Not all day. I had a routine, definitely, um, that I finally fell into after having tried a couple of other things that didn't work. Uh, he offered me an office at Knopf. He was smart enough to know that I had discipline. I mean, I have discipline in my work as an actress, you have to be in the theatre, you have to be on time, you know your lines and all that. And, um, so he had offered me an office, because I was, there was so many distractions at home. Telephones ringing, and doorbells, and who knows, whatever, and the cat, and then you start, your mind wanders, you look out the window, and maybe you'd better go straighten out the closet! [laughs] Anything to avoid sitting down and dealing with it, you know. And so I, I, I fell into a pattern where every morning... ...I mean, the mornings were for, for me to go over the mail, and make any phone calls, any business that I had to transact, whatever. And at around 1:00, I would leave my house and go down to Knopf. And they would say, 'You work in this office today', or 'that office today', whatever. I worked in every office in the publishing house! [laughs] Which was wonderful! It was wonderful, because you see... ...there you are surrounded by books, that's what it's all about. And you're getting no phone calls, no doorbells, nothing personal. You are just there with the paper and pen and with what you have in your head. If I had made any notes, I used to go home at night... ...and if I had to check anything about dates, or if I wanted to kind of revive something in my head, I would try to look things up through what I had. And I, I first put, had put things in kind of chronological order, like letters and photographs that I had had at home. And then, uh, I would, so I would research that period at home, and then the next day I would go in. And I did that five days a week, and I usually worked till 5:00, 5:30, 6:00, depending, you know. And I stopped a couple of times for acting jobs. And, um, I mean it did take over three years, but it was that discipline that enabled me to do it.

Sandra McGrath Three years?

Lauren Bacall Yeah.

Sandra McGrath Well, it's terrible, I mean incredible consistency for someone who worked on it for three years.

Lauren Bacall Well, because...

Sandra McGrath Normally, you break your style over a period of time.

Lauren Bacall Well, you see, people have told me, now of course I'm totally unaware of this, but I have been told that as far as the book is concerned, I have... ...uh, when they read it, they have noticed that my writing has changed as my life changed.

Sandra McGrath Really? I didn't notice that.

Lauren Bacall No, I mean I'm not aware of it, and I was not aware of it, but I kind of found it interesting that that it would affect anyone that way. They would think that my writing got better as I got older. The forward step, better.

Sandra McGrath Yes, I think that's true. I think it got more developed and sound in a sense.

Lauren Bacall Well, it's...

Sandra McGrath It's lovely.

Lauren Bacall It's funny, but, you know, it's much easier to write when you have things happen to you, you know, so much. Whenever anyone says that a lot, you know, 'A good deal of, second, good deal of the book is about Bogie', I say... I say, 'Well, number one, uh, I don't think, I think half of the book is devoted to my, to that period of time... ...that 12, 13-year period when I first went out to California, because that is when everything happened to me. Uh, not just Bogie, I mean that was when I started my career, that was when I left what I've known all my life. And that's when I came, an actress, tried, at least began, and met all these people, all these famous people, all this stuff was going on. Then fell in love, got married, had children, people died. I mean... ...when you have so much to write about, it's bound to take up... [laughter]

Sandra McGrath It takes time.

Lauren Bacall Yeah, it takes, it takes up space. You know, I mean you can't sit and write too much about, 'Oh, I was having a wonderful time' or 'I was miserable, but nothing was happening'. I mean you can't, there's not that much to write.

Sandra McGrath In New York, do you go to Studio 54? Are you in that scene at all, now?

Lauren Bacall I'm not, no. I, I have been to Studio 54 and, I mean, on occasion, but I do not frequent the place. I am not in any set, because, number one, I've avoided that my whole life. I hate that. I mean, even in California, you know, to be just a member of this group, and that. I've always tried to have a variety of friends. Uh, I mean, I've been attracted to people in politics, and I've been attracted to writers, and actors, and musicians, and I just don't... I guess they're all creative in a way, but I mean I just don't... ...that goes, the social scene bores me beyond belief. I mean, if it's not for me, it's not, it's not my scene. I just don't... I don't I don't know what I don't know how Studio 54 has gotten to Australia yet. Has there been a lot written about it here?

Sandra McGrath Oh, not so much here, but just through everybody knows Studio 54.

Lauren Bacall Yeah, but I mean, it's, first of all, you have to be ready to go to a place like that. You really, I love to dance... ...so, uh, first of all, if you go to a place like that, you have to go with someone who knows how to dance. And because, I mean, I don't go there to drug out, or whatever the hell goes on there [laughs]... ...I don't, uh... And I, and I have to be in the mood for it, and I'm not in the mood for it very often, because it's too crowded, too big, too noisy, too psychedelic, too whatever. [laughs] But it's fun if you're, if you're in the mood for it.

Sandra McGrath Part of New York, isn't it?

Lauren Bacall Well, it's part of, a part of New York. I mean, I don't find it as much fun as, uh, sitting around and talking to people.

Sandra McGrath Do you, you collect anything? You like to collect everything? [laughs]

Lauren Bacall Well, I'm a pack rat. I, it's terrible! I mean, I really...

Sandra McGrath What do you collect?

Lauren Bacall I've got stuff! Well, I mean I love antiques. I love, uh, I've, I, I have a house in the country that I bought a year and a half ago. The first house I've ever owned on my own. Never bought a house before in my life. And I finally decided that I'd worked long enough and hard enough that it was damn well time that I had a house of my own to go to instead of going to my friends' houses. Uh, and I collect, uh, well, I collect needlepoint animals, and I, you know, old, English ones. And I collect...

Sandra McGrath Do you mean on cushions?

Lauren Bacall No, on, in frames.

Sandra McGrath Oh, I see.

Lauren Bacall Um, I found a lot of them in England. Most of them in England. Some in New York. Um, and I used, I, I used to collect pewter. I have a very good collection of pewter. But I mean that I use. I don't like to have a lot of stuff just on display, you know, if you know what I mean.

Sandra McGrath Yeah.

Lauren Bacall Uh, because I live a very kind of informal life and my, I have a library that is very cluttered. I used to collect faience, uh, and like a jerk, I got rid of a lot of them when I left California, which was totally the wrong thing to do.

Sandra McGrath One always does that, too.

Lauren Bacall Yeah. [laughs] Always, always. But I love antiques. And so I buy. I mean, there's just so much furniture you can put in your house, you know. And I have walls, there's not a free space anywhere! [laughs]

Sandra McGrath What's on the walls?

Lauren Bacall Everything! Well, I have a lot of memorabilia... Oh! How gorgeous! Thank you, Henrietta. Is that my lemon juice, or a little vinegar? Thank you. Oh, I have to put that in a tall glass and pour cold water on it. This is so naughty. No, thank you. I have to put that in a tall glass, and I have to put water in it. Henrietta, would, would you like something?

Sandra McGrath No, thank you.

Lauren Bacall You sure?

Sandra McGrath No, it's fine, thanks.

Lauren Bacall I'm sorry, I hate to eat in front of you, but that's, uh, that's the schedule that's got me, you know. What can I do?

Sandra McGrath You're having an American club?

Lauren Bacall No, it's bacon, lettuce and tomato on toast.

Sandra McGrath BLT.

Lauren Bacall BLT on toast. [laughs] Thank you.

Sandra McGrath Um, what do you have for breakfast, Lauren?

Lauren Bacall Breakfast is my big meal. It's the only steady meal I have. Come in, Glenn. Hi! I don't have, um, I'm not a big lunch person, and I'm not a big dinner person. Well, I have, I have a big breakfast. First of all, in a way, that started with, uh, um, theatre... ...because you know you sleep so late, in the morning, because you go to bed so late. And I, I used to have kind of brunch, and then not a proper dinner. So it's kind of on a two-meal a day. I mean, my energy is, is...

Sandra McGrath Oh, it smells heavenly! Doesn't it? Oh, it's delicious! Is this some special lemon drink?

Lauren Bacall No, it's just lemon juice with soda water, once in a while, that I like. Very sour. Oh, Jesus! It's, um... They gave me a little more lemon juice than I counted on. You can't win 'em all, you know.

Sandra McGrath Pucker your mouth up.

Lauren Bacall Oh, no, no, that's healthy! That's good for you.

Sandra McGrath Just what's a big breakfast? You know, I have an editor who said to me once, I went out and did an interview, I came back and I said, 'Well, there's some interesting things in there.' And he said, 'Well,' I wrote it out, and he said, 'Well, I want to know what they had for breakfast!' And I've never been able to kind of walk away from an interview now without saying, 'What did you have for breakfast?' [laughter]

Lauren Bacall That is funny! Because he never told me, 'Be sure and tell what you had for breakfast.'

Sandra McGrath Well, you tell me what you have for breakfast first! [laughs]

Lauren Bacall Breakfast? Well, I, I have a big breakfast.

Sandra McGrath What, what is a big breakfast?

Lauren Bacall A big breakfast is...

Sandra McGrath I mean steak and eggs, here? [laughs]

Lauren Bacall Oh, no, not steak! No, but I mean it's usually juice of some sort, and fruit, and, um, bacon and eggs, or, uh...

Sandra McGrath Toast, marmalade and all that?

Lauren Bacall Toast, and tea. Tea is my, I'm a tea drinker more than a coffee drinker. Um... I mean, that's, it seems, it seems big to me! [laughs] As opposed to the orange juice, toast, and coffee, which is what an awful lot of Americans have for breakfast. A lot of people can't eat in the morning, but I can, that's the one time I'm really hungry.

Lauren Bacall It seems to me it is not in my makeup. I choose to have things going to happen with the dead city. Do you think there's a possibility about Australia? Do you want this for Saturday? Oh, Sandra Weidenfeld, tomorrow's the first day of summer. For June, I would think they would change the month. Yes, that's what it was, because I knew it was bad.

Lauren Bacall Did you order them 10 at a time or a dozen at a time?

Interviewer Yes, that's right. I dropped them off. I had them in the back of the car each time.

Lauren Bacall Good. Very good.

Interviewer If you need any copies for anything, I have them too, of course. I actually read the book when I was in New York in January, never dreaming I should ever meet you.

Lauren Bacall Oh, did you? Is that right?

Interviewer Yes. Good. I have a friend, actually, who lives in in your building, who you might know, called Pauline Pinter. Have you ever run into her? In the Dakota. Pauline Pinter. Joe and—well, they're divorced now, but Pauline and Joe Pinter have been living in the Dakota for years.

Lauren Bacall What's she look like?

Interviewer She's got long, blonde hair

Lauren Bacall I'm so bad on names.

Interviewer and clomps around in jeans most of the time.

Lauren Bacall So do we all. Who isn't? It's open. Why is this room left open like this all the time? Because the maid leaves and she leaves the door open. No, the door. I'll tell them. I don't understand that. My god, those are beautiful gladiolas, aren't they?

Interviewer They're just gorgeous.

Lauren Bacall I mean, they really are.

Interviewer A breath of spring.

Lauren Bacall Yes, a breath of I don't know what.

Interviewer Where do they come from?

Lauren Bacall Listen, let me just run upstairs for one second. Sit down, won't you? Would you like something?

Interviewer No.

Lauren Bacall A glass of—

Interviewer No, no, thank you. I've never been in one of these. This is the first nice room I've seen in this place.

Lauren Bacall It's very nice, isn't it?

Interviewer It's very good, this. What do you think of our strike-ridden country, which has thrown us all into chaos?

Lauren Bacall Well, I mean, the suspense is killing us as to what's going to happen. I'll be right with you.

Interviewer Right. Sure. It's quiet.

Lauren Bacall I always forget machines, that they never work either.

Interviewer What was, uh, how—how did, you mean, how did it work out? It's a taped show. It's not a live show.

Lauren Bacall No, it's live. Live show.

Interviewer A live show at 12:00?

Lauren Bacall Yeah, at 12:00.

Interviewer Really? Do you enjoy your Mike Walsh show out here?

Lauren Bacall Yeah. Well, you know, as—

Interviewer Thank you.

Lauren Bacall Okay, cheers. As you get to know someone a little bit better, you know,

Interviewer It gets easier.

Lauren Bacall it all becomes much—I mean, he's really terrific, you know. It becomes a much friendlier operation and much easier.

Interviewer Look, a little peanut.

Lauren Bacall Peanut.

Interviewer Look at these. Aren't they fascinating? From Taiwan.

Lauren Bacall How strange. Are they edible?

Interviewer Listen, can we just talk a bit about— How are they?

Lauren Bacall What?

Interviewer Did they take care of your cat? Are they—

Lauren Bacall No.

Interviewer No? Um,

Lauren Bacall Talk about what?

Interviewer Anything. Anything, anything.

Lauren Bacall Anything, anything.

Interviewer I want to know just a bit about New York life, what you do, who you see,

Lauren Bacall Oh.

Interviewer why you live there instead of California,

Lauren Bacall Well, I haven't lived in California since 1950— since uh, January '59 I left. That's 20 years ago. I had no reason to live there. I mean, I—I had my life there, and I really thought that I had kind of beginning, a middle, and an end. I had a complete life there, and I— I think it's no place for a woman alone to be anyway.

Interviewer California?

Lauren Bacall California.

Interviewer Most people say New York is.

Lauren Bacall Oh, no, but there's so much that's interesting in New York. There's so much more to do. There's so much more to see. I mean, if you're an actress, and if you're in the film world, in California, it's— you kind of are apt to fall into a pattern of seeing the same people, and it's also— I mean, you see the same people anywhere, but—but uh they become very um— it's always, "Oh, what are you doing next?" or "What are you doing—" I mean, it's— there's an overconcentration on one thing as opposed to, I mean, in New York, although I'm in the theater and a lot of my friends are in the theater, you know, one has many, many more interests.

Interviewer What are your interests outside the theater?

Lauren Bacall Well, I mean, I love to go—there are concerts to go to all the time, there's ballet to go to all the time, there are— There's always something happening in New York.

Interviewer What's your favorite restaurant?

Lauren Bacall Um, I guess my favorite restaurant is um, uh, my favorite food really is Chinese food.

Interviewer Does that mean you go to—

Lauren Bacall Oh, I go to Pearl's a lot. I—I don't, I really hate to go to restaurants, I have to tell you. I don't go to them much. Uh, I will go to Pearl's for Chinese food because I love Chinese food.

Interviewer Is Pearl's P-E-A-R-L-S?

Lauren Bacall Yes. Uh, oh, I go to Elaine's. I mean, not for the food, but I go to Elaine's for the whole, for Elaine and the whole feeling of Elaine's. Um, and a lot of my friends go there. You know, we go there together.

Interviewer Who are the friends you still see in New York?

Lauren Bacall Well, my closest, uh, I suppose the woman I feel closest to is uh probably Phyllis Newman, who's married to Adolph Green, and Mary Stone, who's married to Peter Stone. I guess they're my two closest friends in New York that I see regularly, a lot of. Um, and I see uh, I mean, Betty Comden and her—and her husband a lot. I mean, they're friends I've had for a long time. And Arthur Laurents is a very good friend of mine. I'm trying to think of the people that I see most. Uh, Katie Hepburn, of course, is a very good friend of mine, but I see, you know, she moves around and I move around, but we keep— I mean, I keep a constant check on Kate, just to check in with her to see if she's okay and, you know, just say hello, and she is, yeah, just say hello, and she's wonderful.

Interviewer She's fine. Is she working on something?

Lauren Bacall Not that I know of, but I mean, I've been moving around so much that I really can't say. She just finished this—she finished that The Corn Is Green that I—I didn't see. I was—I was in Florida, I guess, making the, the Altman film then. I see um, I mean, I find that I— I mean, I always see, have this nucleus of friends, you know, that I see in New York. And uh, then I go to the theater a lot. I mean, when there's something to see, and I have a lot of friends in the theater.

Interviewer How do you think of the New York theater's—the state of the New York theater at the moment?

Lauren Bacall Well, at the moment, uh at the moment, as far as the audiences are concerned, uh we have—I guess there are—there are more people going to the theater in New York this year than have in years.

Interviewer What about the quality of the plays?

Lauren Bacall Uh, we unhappily do not have a lot of uh producing playwrights at the moment. Um, we have not had anywhere near as many original plays as I would love to see. Uh, a lot of our our theater is is is comes from England, or at least a good part of it does. We have um our musical theater, of course, is very much our own, which is is wonderful. But I mean, there can't be that many marvelous musicals. Well, Steve Sondheim and Hal Prince together create the best musicals and, I mean, they can't do five a year. They could do one every couple of years or whatever. Um,

Interviewer Have you ever considered acting in an Australian play? Do you know any of the Australian playwrights?

Lauren Bacall I don't know anything about them, not at all.

Interviewer Off the—off the record, they're very good, some of them.

Lauren Bacall I—I don't uh, I'm I'm totally unfamiliar with them. I I I know when I was in England, when I lived in England for a couple of years, I mean, there's I love Stoppard and Pinter and they've got some wonderful playwrights there. But they really do write for English actors. They don't write for Americans. They're English. Why should they write for Americans? Uh, and hopefully, um we have a couple of—

Interviewer You don't think you're an English—I'm sorry. You don't think an American actress can act in an English play?

Lauren Bacall Well, I think we can, but I think if if you're supposed to be English, I mean, well, it's better to get an English actress, right? I mean, they're not going to give the part to an American if they can give it to uh an English actress. Then after that, Equity has its rules.

Interviewer I guess they do, too.

Lauren Bacall Well, how can you forget about the unions? How could us?

Interviewer How could us?

Lauren Bacall Although we have we have a lot of English imports in uh New York. And um, Tom Conti, for example, who made this big hit in Whose Life Is It Anyway? in England, at first American Equity was not going to let him in, and they did finally succeed in bringing him in. And uh, of course, he won the Tony. Uh, and he is he is very good, that's— No. But I mean, the theater is, you know, it's it's—Larry Olivier said to me once years ago when I said, "Why do you have all the playwrights and we have none?" you know. And he said, "But everything goes in cycles." He said, "At the time that you had Tennessee Williams and Arthur Miller and everyone was writing so many plays in America, we didn't have any. Now it's our turn. It'll come around to you again." So I mean, I I hope he's right. You know, I hope that I hope that uh we have some playwrights, some new young playwrights, but they have not written—there are not many parts for women written. It's again that problem. I mean, that's the problem in in um in films as well. There have not been enough enough parts. And I—

Interviewer You think women's lib might change that?

Lauren Bacall I don't think so, because, I mean, uh funnily enough, even some of the women writers don't write for women. I mean, I—well, I don't know. I don't know, I uh— I mean, hopefully that will change. I mean, that's all you can do is hope that it will change, so that you can work. Um,

Interviewer About the book for a minute, um tell me, I was incredibly impressed by your ability to recall the past with such detail. Did you keep scrapbooks? Did you—what did you do? How did you—

Lauren Bacall Well, I have scrapbooks, but scrapbooks come from uh, I mean, scrapbooks really are full of uh photographs and articles and things like that. They're not personal. Um, I did not keep diaries. I do have uh a memory for detail.

Interviewer Where do you keep that memory?

Lauren Bacall I don't know. I've always had it. I've I've always been rather uh preoccupied with detail, which is, um as I have said times, has driven my children crazy and uh, sometimes my friends.

Interviewer How does that come out beside for me having total recall for writing a book?

Lauren Bacall Uh, before. I mean, I never have sat down and told them the story of my life, you know. Uh, they garner bits of your life as you go along, and you say, "I remember that my mother said this to me," or "My grandmother did this," or "I did this," whatever. But I mean, to read the whole thing from beginning to end, they, they, one does get a much better sense of what you're all about. Um, and also, this much attention has never been paid to me by the public at large. I have never had so much attention as I've had since the book was published.

Interviewer More than applause in, uh, in the movies?

Lauren Bacall That was, no, that was all, uh, it was different. I mean, I had attention when I first went into films as a new discovery, um, and that was excitement, and that was all connected with the one thing. And then, of course, my whole romance with Bogie and marriage. That, that was that kind of attention. And applause was theater accomplishment. But this seems to be more. Uh, this obviously has reached more people, it seems. Um, I mean, I noticed when I, I mean, I, I was just in France for the French, uh, publication of my book, and I noticed when I went to restaurants that I always go to when I'm in France, uh, the ladies that mind the ladies' loo and, uh, the cigarette girls, what, I mean, that know me, that have seen me before, never paid very much attention to me. And this trip, they kind, they talked to me, you know, as though they really knew me.

Interviewer The celluloid image were away and made you into a three-dimensional person for people.

Lauren Bacall Maybe. Maybe.

Interviewer I think that's fine, too. It makes you a human being.

Lauren Bacall I don't know, but it seems to have, uh, it's, I, I mean, it's, it seems to have made more of an impression, and, uh, there has been a greater connection somehow through the book. Uh, and I, I mean, I have, I have been recognized before when I go any place, you know, but it's, uh, been compounded, I think, since the book.

Interviewer Do you think it's a sort of rather nice comment on the people, actually?

Lauren Bacall Well, it's terrific, because I think the people have... I suppose they feel they know me better, um, and they do. [laughter] They do, you see. It is, it is, um...

Interviewer Does that have a... Does that... Were you... When you set out to do the book, did you say, "All right, I'm not going to do it unless I am completely honest with what I think"? Or did you...?

Lauren Bacall Well, I knew that I would only do it that way. I mean, I've been asked for years to write a book. Uh, I've been asked to write it with people. I've been asked to write about, uh, Hollywood, I've been asked to write about Bogie, I've been asked to write books about my opinions, uh, of almost anything, and, of course, I never felt that anyone gave a damn what my opinions were, so I... And I would never have written a book just about my life with Bogie, or Hollywood, or... It did not interest me, and I certainly would never have written it with anyone. I have never felt that that an autobiography should be written by anyone else other than the person whose life it is. And I have never seen the point to it if you don't tell the truth. I don't see the point to much if you don't tell the truth. I mean, I like to, I like to know where I am, and I like to know where other people are, and I believe in telling the truth. So, I mean, I knew that that when I did it, and I did it because Bob Gottlieb was the first person that said he wanted to know my whole life.

Interviewer Was he the publisher?

Lauren Bacall The publisher and editor, he's head of Knopf in, uh, New York. And he, he said he wanted me to write my whole life. He wanted to know why I survived, well, instead of ending up, uh, drunk, or in the gutter, or God knows where, depending upon, you know, uh, because my career has been very up and down. And I don't know, I mean, I suppose...

Interviewer What's the answer to that, though? You've sort of answered towards the end, but...

Lauren Bacall Yeah, the answer to what? I don't...

Interviewer Why, why you survived. What makes a survivor, in other words? What makes a survivor?

Lauren Bacall Well, I, I mean, I think really, I, I mean, what I started out in life with, which is what my mother gave me, what my family gave me. I think I had a core, a sense of what was right and wrong, and of what was important and what wasn't. Um, I think my, I started off life with very clear values. Um, and I think I, and I got that from my mother and my grandmother and my uncle. And I think when you start out with that, when that's laid in very strong, you never forget that. You don't ever lose that. And then, of course...

Interviewer Talent. Excuse me? Talent.

Lauren Bacall Well, [laughter] I hope so. But I, I, uh, I think that, that, that is the reason I probably have the strength to cope with a lot of things in my life that maybe I, I would not have been able to cope with if I hadn't had that inner strength. Um, and then, of course, Bogie just added to that, because he, his feeling about character and behavior was certainly every bit as strong as my mother's was, so that I had it for many years, kind of drummed into me. [laughter] It's hard to lose that, and I don't want to lose it. But you don't ever forget that, you see. And I have, I had such a close relationship with my mother that I always, I mean, if I did anything wrong, I'd just look at her, my conscience was right there, I could see, I mean, I knew when I, I knew when I was wrong. God knows I've been wrong in my life. Um, I think that really is the reason that, that I've been able to, to deal with a lot of, uh, negative things that have happened to me.

Interviewer Of course, to the outside world, your life wouldn't look at all... In this, when you read that book, one would have no idea that you had been through such, uh, traumatic times in your, in your life. Part of it.

Lauren Bacall Yeah. Well, I mean, I have been very lucky in some areas. Certainly, I have. And at some periods of my life. My career has been very up and down and very in and out. Um, I had, I had, uh, very high highs and very low lows. And I had a lot, I had many periods when I couldn't get a job. Um, I mean, I couldn't get a decent job. Could get lousy jobs. There were always those available. Um, and also when people don't really, they don't really think you're very good, you know, or they don't think about you at all. I mean, that happens in, that happens a lot in California. And actually, since the book, I mean, even in California, they look at me differently. So I suddenly am, uh, now maybe it's just the time. You know, maybe you just have to live a certain length of time and go through whatever you have to go through in life, which I suppose we all do. And suddenly, uh, they look at you with different eyes. I mean, I'm the same person I was a year ago, but to an awful lot of people, I'm, I suddenly have been rediscovered. I'm not complaining about it. It's wonderful. Um...

Interviewer Again, you see, to the average public, one would assume that you were always in the public, uh, to the public image. You were always being considered as always, um...

Lauren Bacall Yeah, but it has not been the case. I mean, my name has always been, uh, in the public eye. I have all, I mean, my name is in the newspapers, God knows, more often than I would like it to be a lot of the time. And that's luck. I don't know why that's happened. I mean, I've never had press agents and I don't, you know, I don't live like that, so I don't, it hasn't been anything that I've done consciously. So I think maybe that's just my good fortune. Uh, but now it's, now it is, I mean, I am very firmly established, it seems. And I just, uh, I hope that I will have more work offers. And I mean, I have had, and I, and that's been coincidentally, oddly enough, because the the Altman film was on the fire before the book ever came out. I knew that I was going to do that, and, uh, the fact...

Interviewer What's the name of that film?

Lauren Bacall HealtH. HealtH. Uh, the film I'm going to do next for Stigwood, uh, you start, I mean, he's wanted me to do it ever since he owned it, which is, uh, the last couple of years, The Fan.

Interviewer The Fan.

Lauren Bacall So that that, I mean, that just happened to come out, you know, all of it's happening at the same time. And it, those two things are not the result of the book. But it just seem, I mean, uh, I mean, my publisher thought that the book would do well, but I mean he had no idea it would do as well as it's done. I certainly didn't have any idea it would do that well. I didn't, you know, you just don't know what to expect.

Interviewer It's a well-deserved win, by the way. Very, very good.

Lauren Bacall Oh, thank you. I, I'm, I'm, I'm very happy with the success of it, and I'm, I'm surprised, but very happy, that that many people are interested. I've gotten some wonderful letters. And and what pleases me a lot is that I've gotten a lot of letters, uh, from people who not only have understood and appreciated my relationship with my mother, but who also, because of of what I wrote about my mother, have made their attitudes change toward their mothers, which is kind of nice, you know.

Interviewer Very nice.

Lauren Bacall Yeah, and it's, it's, uh, that's rewarding, it's, it's, uh... Because I don't feel, you see, that during my mother's lifetime, I really ever made her feel as much as I would have liked to.

Interviewer I don't think anyone ever feels that until it's over.

Lauren Bacall Yeah, I know, it's true. Hello? Excuse me. Is that who? Who, who's calling, please? I, I, I can't understand what you said. I'm sorry, what was that? Yes. All right.

Interviewer That sounds like an inconclusive call.

Lauren Bacall That was my room, but I couldn't understand, was that Room... because they ordered, because we have to eat while we're...

Interviewer On the run.

Lauren Bacall No, while we're talking. Um... No, it's true, you don't ever. You always say, "If only I'd done this," or "If only I'd done that."

Interviewer "If I'd only told her."

Lauren Bacall I know it, I know it. It's really, life is always like that. Not a damn thing you can do about it. Well, everyone, I mean, my kids will have to find out. You know, everyone does.

Interviewer I must say that the most, I think, I can't think of really, the death scenes in the book are really heart-rending. I don't know how you could even bring yourself somehow to recall them. They are so poignant.

Lauren Bacall But you don't ever forget that, you see, I mean, that's so vivid, you can't forget it. And, you see, it, because...

Interviewer It's a constant theme through your book, though. Even it's, you herald it even in the very beginning. Somehow that even seems to me, realising it.

Lauren Bacall Well, it's been a very strange pattern. I, [cough] I realized that I suddenly was, I had always had to tell my mother about deaths in her family, you know, her mother and her brother, and I suddenly realized that I was the one that was always breaking the news to her, and I thought, "Why?"

Interviewer "Why should it always be me?"

Lauren Bacall Yeah, so weird that that happens to you in life, isn't it?

Interviewer That these are meaningful occasions.

Lauren Bacall And that is a, that that was a pattern in my life, and, uh, God knows it's not an easy thing to do.

Interviewer Were you conscious of that when you were starting writing the book, or before you wrote?

Lauren Bacall No. Well, I mean, I'd always, I'd always known that it was a pattern. I had always thought that it was a very curious thing that I had, uh, told my mother, that I had been the one who had had to tell her about her mother's death, about both her brothers. Um, I always found that kind of weird. I'd always felt it was weird. It was weird. [laughter] And, um, you know, you always think, "Oh, there must be a reason for this. There's usually a reason for everything." Well, the hell there is. There is, sometimes there's no reason for anything. It just happens. Um, but I mean, I didn't set out to say, "Well, I'm going to put this down and that down," and, you know, I just, I really tried to just get it down on paper just as I remembered.

Interviewer Did you do many drafts?

Lauren Bacall No, I overwrote to an incredible degree. [laughter] Uh, detail, you see. [laughter] Um, and my, I worried about that, [cough] and I asked Gottlieb about it, and he said, "Don't worry about it." He said, "That's my job. I'm the editor. You just get it down on paper." And, uh, And so then I stopped worrying about it. And I, I had to, um, not, well, I guess I rewrote certain... After I finished the book, then he went through it, and, because you know, I mean you have no perspective. And and then he told me what he felt needed fleshing out. And then if I agreed with him, I said all right, otherwise, I didn't agree, you know, whatever, back and forth. And he, he's a tremendously sensitive and, uh, smart, and perceptive man, and was really tremendously helpful. Uh, I don't think I could have done it with anyone else. And then I, I, I, I, I didn't rewrite the whole book, but I just added certain things to various sections of the book, or or rewrote it, reconstructed some of it. There were some areas that I felt were lacking, but not a lot. I mean it was more, more, more repetition that was cut out than anything. 'Cause I mean you can't write as many words as I wrote and not repeat yourself. I mean I wrote endless, endless, almost 1,500 pages, longhand. I didn't know what the hell I was writing after a while, you know, you get...

Sandra McGrath Did you write all day? Did you have a routine that you wrote all day?

Lauren Bacall Not all day. I had a routine definitely, um, that I finally fell into after having tried a couple of other things that didn't work. Uh, he offered me an office at Knopf. He was smart enough to know that I had discipline. I mean, I am disciplined in my work as an actress, you have to be in the theater and you have to be in film. You have to be there on time, and you have to know your lines and all the rest of it. And, um, so he had offered me an office because I was at... there were so many distractions at home. Uh, the telephones ringing and doorbells and who knows whatever and you can't. And then you start, your mind wanders, you look out the window and you think, well, I think I'll straighten out the closet. Anything to avoid sitting down and dealing with it, you know. And so I, I, I fell into a pattern where every morning, I mean, the mornings were for for me to go over the mail and to make any phone calls, any business that I had to transact, whatever. And at around 1:00, I would leave my house and go down to Knopf. And they would say you work in this office today or that office today, whatever. I worked in every office in the publishing house. Which was wonderful. It was wonderful because you see, they... you are surrounded by books. That's what it's all about. And you're getting no phone calls, no doorbells, nothing personal, and you are just there with the paper, the pen, with what you have in your head. If I had made any notes, I used to go home at night and if I had to check anything about dates or if I wanted to kind of revive something in my head, I would try to look things up through what I had. And I, I first put, had put things in kind of chronological order, like letters and photographs that I had had at home. And then, uh, I would, so I would research that period at home, and then the next day... And I did that five days a week. And I'd usually work till 5:00, 5:30, 6:00, depending, you know. And I stopped a couple of times for acting jobs. And, um, I mean it did take over three years, but it was that discipline that enabled me to do it.

Sandra McGrath There's an incredible consistency for someone who worked on it for three years.

Lauren Bacall Well, because...

Sandra McGrath Normally you break your your style in a period of time, don't you?

Lauren Bacall Well, you see, people have told me, now of course I'm totally unaware of this, but I have been told that as far as the book is concerned, I have, uh, when they read it, they have noticed that my writing has changed as my life changed.

Sandra McGrath Really? I didn't notice that.

Lauren Bacall Now, I mean, I'm not aware of it, and I was not aware of it. But I kind of found it interesting that that it would affect anyone that way. They would think that my writing got better as I got older, and could put words together better.

Sandra McGrath Yes, I think that's true. I think it got more developed, sounding, in a sense. Developed.

Lauren Bacall Well, it's... You're a lot... It's funny, but you know it's much easier to write when you have, when things happen to you, you know. So much, whenever anyone says that a lot, you know, that I, uh... that a good deal of that a good deal of the book is about, uh, Bogie, I say, I say, well, number one, uh, I don't think, I think half of the book is devoted to to that period of time, that 12, 13-year period when I first went out to California, because that is when everything happened to me. Uh, not just Bogie. I mean, that was when I started my career. That was when I left what I've known all my life, and that's when I became an actress, or I tried, at least began, and met all these people, all these famous people, all this stuff was going on. Then fell in love, got married, had children, people died. I mean, when you have so much to write about, it's bound to take up space. Yeah, it takes up it takes up space. Yeah, I mean you can't sit and write too much about, 'Oh, I was having a wonderful time,' or 'I was miserable and nothing was happening.' I mean you can't, not that much to write, you know.

Sandra McGrath In New York, do you go to Studio 54 and are you in that set at all now?

Lauren Bacall I'm not. No, I I have been to Studio 54 and I'm on occasion, but I do not frequent the place. And I am not in any set because number one, I've avoided that my whole life. I hate that. I mean, even in California, you know, to be just a member of this group, and that I've always tried to have a variety of friends. Um, I mean I've been attracted to people in politics, and I've been attracted to to writers and actors and musicians, and I just don't, I guess they're all creative in a way, but I mean I just don't... And God knows the social scene bores me beyond belief. I mean, it is not for me. I'm not... It's not my scene. I just don't... I don't I don't know what I don't know how Studio 54 has has gotten to Australia. Has there been a lot written about it here?

Sandra McGrath Oh, not so much here, but just through everybody knows, do you know?

Lauren Bacall Yeah, but I mean it's First of all, you have to be ready to go to a place like that. You really... I love to dance. So, uh, first of all, if you go to a place like that, you have to go with someone who knows how to dance. And because you, I mean I don't go there to drug out or whatever the hell goes on there. I don't, uh, and I and I I have to be in the mood for it, and I'm not in the mood for it very often, because it's too crowded, too huge, too big, too noisy, too psychedelic, too whatever. But it's fun if you're if you're in the mood for it.

Sandra McGrath It's part of New York now, definitely. It's part of the New York...

Lauren Bacall Well, it's part of a part of New York. I mean, I don't find it as much fun as, uh, sitting around and talking to people.

Sandra McGrath Tell me, are you do you collect anything?

Lauren Bacall I collect everything. I'm a pack rat. It's terrible. I mean, I really, I've got to stop. Well, I mean I love antiques. I love, uh, I've I I have a house in the country that I bought a year and a half ago, the first house I've ever owned on my own. Never bought a house before in my life, and I finally decided that I'd worked long enough and hard enough and it was damn well time that I had a house of my own to go to instead of going to my friends' houses. Uh, and I collect, uh, well, I collect needlepoint animals, and I, you know, old ones, and I collect, uh...

Sandra McGrath You mean on cushions and things?

Lauren Bacall No, in frames.

Sandra McGrath Oh, in frames.

Lauren Bacall Um, I found a lot of them in England, most of them in England. Some in New York. Um, and I used I I used to collect pewter. I have a very good collection of pewter. I mean, that I use. I don't like to have a lot of stuff just on display, kind of, you know what I mean? Yeah, because I live a very kind of informal life and my... I have a library that is very cluttered. I used to collect faience, uh, and like a jerk I got rid of a lot of it when I left for California, and of all the wrong things, of course. But I love...

Sandra McGrath One always does that, too.

Lauren Bacall Yeah. Always, always. But I love antiques. And so I'm buying... I mean, there's just so much furniture you can put in your house, you know, and I have the walls, there's not a free space anywhere. What's on the walls? The walls? Well, I have a lot of memorabilia. Oh, how gorgeous. Thank you. Sandwiches. Is that my lemon juice? I can put that in a tall glass and I want to put some Perrier in it. Oh, thank you. I have to put that in a tall glass, I have to put some Perrier with it. Would you like something?

Sandra McGrath No, thank you.

Lauren Bacall You sure? You want me to sign them? Sorry to have to do this with you here, but that's the schedule they've got me on. What can I tell you?

Sandra McGrath You're having an American club.

Lauren Bacall No, it's bacon, lettuce, and tomato.

Sandra McGrath BLT.

Lauren Bacall BLT on toast. Tea.

Sandra McGrath Tea and cheese.

Lauren Bacall Thank you.

Sandra McGrath What do you have for breakfast, by the way?

Lauren Bacall Breakfast is my big meal. It's the only steady meal I have. Come in, Glenn. Hi. I don't have, um, I'm not a big lunch person, and I'm not a big dinner person, but I have I'm a big breakfast person, and and in a way that started with, um, the theater, because, you know, you you sleep so late in the morning because you go to bed so late. So I I used to have kind of brunch and and not a proper dinner, so I was kind of on a two meal a day... Hey, that's my lemon juice. Very small amount. Is this some special lemon drink? No, it's just lemon juice with soda. once in a while, but I like it. It's very sour. Ooh, Jesus! It's, um... They gave me a little more lemon juice than I counted on. You can't win them all, you know. Probably my fault. No, no, that's all right.

Sandra McGrath Just, what's a big breakfast? You know, I have an editor who said to me once, I went out and did an interview and I came back and said there's, ooh, big, big, some interesting things in that, and he said, 'Well,' I wrote it up and he said, 'Well, I don't know what they have for breakfast.' And I've never been able to get, walk away from an interview now without saying, 'What did you have for breakfast?'

Lauren Bacall That's funny. Listen, you never told me what Shirley said about her book. What was that?

Sandra McGrath Well, you tell me what you have for breakfast first.

Lauren Bacall Breakfast? Well, I I have a big breakfast.

Sandra McGrath What is What is a big breakfast then?

Lauren Bacall A big breakfast is...

Sandra McGrath I mean steak and eggs? Here...

Lauren Bacall Oh, no, not steak. No, but I mean it's usually juice of some sort, and fruit, and um, bacon and eggs, or, um...

Sandra McGrath Toast, marmalade, all that. American...

Lauren Bacall And tea. Tea is what... I'm a I'm a tea drinker, more than a coffee drinker. Um... I mean that's... It seems, seems big to me, as opposed to to orange juice, toast and coffee, which is what an an awful lot of Americans have for breakfast. A lot of people can't eat in the morning, but I can. That's That's the one time I'm really hungry, is in the morning.

Sandra McGrath That's nice, isn't it? To be hungry in the morning. Well, I'm I'm the black coffee...

Interviewer ...missed the call... it takes time to catch up... She didn't realise how hard it was... she didn't realize until her body...

Lauren Bacall I don't know where I am half the time. Oh, and my body has just, it's very hard. You can tell your body all you want to, but it'll go just so far and no further.

Sandra McGrath Do you have Do you exercise at a gym during the week or something, or do you walk in Central Park or what?

Lauren Bacall Well, I walk a lot.

Sandra McGrath Like all New Yorkers. Mm.

Lauren Bacall When I'm in New York regularly, I exercise at home. But I do, there's a, I do ballet exercise, and I also do Nikolais, which is a kind of combination of, um, I suppose, kind of yoga, they're kind of stretching exercises.

Sandra McGrath It's called Nikolais, what? Stretching exercise?

Lauren Bacall Floor, yes, it's it's a it's it's, um, based on stretching. Nikolais is a kind of exercise that has been... I mean there's a book about it, the Nikolais Technique, but it is based on on floor exercises, and on stretching all of your muscles, and on breathing. It's... I mean it's it's very good. Because of my damn leg, you know, I can't, I mean I hate it. The idea of jogging makes me ill. So boring.

Sandra McGrath I concur. I concur. I hate that idea of it myself. Boring.

Lauren Bacall But, um... But there's not too much I can do. I swim a lot in the summer. I love to swim. That's the one thing I still can do with my damn knee. Which one do you like? Well, I tore my two cartilage in my left knee. The second one happened on the stage. Applause, remember?

Sandra McGrath Ah, that's right. I thought that was all fixed up, though.

Lauren Bacall There's no way to fix it. I mean, once you've torn the cartilage in your knee, you've torn the cartilage in your knee, but only, you could have surgery and have it removed, which I did not do, because I mean, I think you should avoid surgery whenever possible. Um, and the doctor did not feel that it would necessarily improve my leg, because he thought I'd done ligament damage. And as long as I keep it strong, which of course I don't do when I travel, because there's no way to do it. So there's, you know, this... I can't play tennis. I can play tennis if I wear a brace, a hinged brace.

Sandra McGrath Oh, that's fun. Yeah, that looks cute with the tennis dress.

Lauren Bacall Cute? I thought it would be kind of cute, so I just thought that I'd pass. So it does limit you. You don't realize how important your knees are. You wouldn't ever think that a knee matters.

Sandra McGrath Well, I would know. Like, my son got a needle, he jumped on the bed and went and landed on a sewing needle and it broke off in his kneecap, and three operations later it's still not right.

Sandra McGrath So if something didn't go on, I would be disappointed, wouldn't you? Anyway, now, she said when I asked her what happened to... Anyway, I couldn't, I thought they'd ask her every question possible. One of the nice questions that she answered, she said, somebody said, "Miss Frayn, are you as successful with men as your brother is with women?" And I thought that was a funny question, and she said—she said, "Well, actually," she said, "I think that by the time I finish talking, that the men are so exhausted that they're worn out."

Lauren Bacall Right.

Sandra McGrath I thought that was a lovely answer.

Lauren Bacall Yeah.

Sandra McGrath 'Cause she does chatter. I mean, she's a marvellous chatterer.

Lauren Bacall Well, she's full of opinions, she's not reticent about voicing them.

Sandra McGrath No.

Lauren Bacall Which is fine.

Sandra McGrath Uh, anyway, she did... Oh God, I'm long-winded. She said about the book that it had had a tremendous impact on her mother and father in particular, because her mother was shattered by the revelations that she had made about her mother, and her father, who actually got the harsher treatment in the book, I assume you've read it? [Lauren: No, I haven't. I haven't, but I haven't read it.] The Other Side of the Mountain, that one. Not the one about China, the first one. [Lauren: No, yeah, the first one, yeah.] And that her father, who actually got a... There is a really horrific scene in the, in the first chapter that really is, you know, quite reading. It says she does, doesn't get the part in Cinderella, because she's out running, and 14th or 15th, and she comes home and cries, and her father stands there and berates her and says, "You, I told you not to try to get above yourself, you mustn't try to be always having your head in the clouds, you can't do things like that." And she gets so upset she throws up on the stairs, it's all in the book, and he just steps over it and walks away from her.

Lauren Bacall Charming.

Sandra McGrath And her mother she describes as always someone who said, "Well, tomorrow things will be better, dear, don't let's worry about it. Sweep, the sweep the problem under the carpet" type. And she said, in the end, I mean, her mother was quite shattered by the revelation she made about her, but her father in the end, being, given his personality, began to see himself as the star of the book.

Lauren Bacall That's funny.

Sandra McGrath So that was what really made for it, wasn't it?

Lauren Bacall Mm, funny.

Sandra McGrath Yes, but in your case it really would be more your children

Lauren Bacall Mm, oh, definitely.

Sandra McGrath than your parents.

Lauren Bacall Well, the children are It's a very hard decision to make to, writing about your children.

Sandra McGrath That is a very difficult decision.

Lauren Bacall Because from their point of view, I mean, you want to say enough about what you feel about them, but you don't want to make them uncomfortable about it. And it is hard, and also, with three children, you have to keep a balance there somehow, which is, it's not always easy to do, because of different stages.

Sandra McGrath They all, children have different importance in life.

Lauren Bacall Yes. [Sandra McGrath: A mother of five.] Five? Jesus, that's a lot. I'll say it is. But I mean, I, you know, with three of them, and of course, you know, I mean, I'm closer to the one that I live with, obviously, I mean, that's... But it...

Sandra McGrath Do you think working women are good for children?

Lauren Bacall I do. I think that, I think children should realize that there's a, a big world out there, and that, um, work is a necessary and important part of life, and I think it's much more interesting to have a working mother than a non-working mother. And it, it, it seems to me that, although perhaps they're not there all the time in the way you would want them there, they're much more interesting people because they have not overconcentrated and overfocused, you know, on, on on you as a child. It would seem, to me, I would think so.

Sandra McGrath More realistic, in other words.

Lauren Bacall Well, it is, it is. I mean, it is the way things are. It's, I think it's the way they ought to be. Uh, I mean, some women just are much happier at home and prefer that, well, I mean, then they probably function much better that way. I don't really suppose there's a formula. I just, I just uh I think it depends upon how you you kind of do your best, or you can where you can perform the most effectively. As far as uh my children are concerned, I mean, I've, I've been torn all my life. I mean, always when I wasn't with them I wanted to be with them, and when I was with them I wanted to be somewhere else. [laughter] So I've been dragged always. I mean, my, my innards have been just wrenched from half of me here and half of me there. But I feel that um I want them to understand uh the value of work and the value of having other interests, and also it is not in my makeup. I, I would not have been good standing over a hot stove all day. I would have driven myself and them stark staring mad.

Sandra McGrath I I agree with that.

Lauren Bacall I mean, it just suits some people.

Sandra McGrath I don't really understand why anyone would want to stand over a stove.

Lauren Bacall No, I, I couldn't. I really couldn't. It is just not for me.

Sandra McGrath Well, babies finish when someone's 7 or 10 or something.

Lauren Bacall I mean, I don't, you know, I just think to give them companionship and to keep them interested, I just think they're lucky if their parents work, mothers work. I think, I think I think, as you choose to have children, I think you owe them something. Um, I think you owe concern and being with them as much as possible in their, in their growing years. But I also think they could, you know, they could have to learn to give a little too. Children, as you know, are very demanding. I was certainly very demanding of my mother, but my mother concentrated on me, but I was an only child. Well she, even though she was a working woman, she was just geared for that. And her work was a nine-to-five job, so she was, it was much more regular than mine. I think my work is. My kids, I just feel terribly guilty. Now they, I hardly see my kids now, because I've kind of traveled so much this year. I've been running, I'm not any place long enough.

Sandra McGrath Listen, Mr. Alford?

Interviewer Yes.

Sandra McGrath May I use the telephone to call a cab?

Lauren Bacall Absolutely.

Sandra McGrath No, no, no, because I can't get texts, All right, this will be fine.

Lauren Bacall You might... Not at all. Just, you have to call the operator, I guess, do you? Oh no, nine. What is it, nine?

Interviewer Ring the operator, they're on nine. Ask them to do it.

Sandra McGrath Oh, Gladys Cole's apartment is 1140.

Lauren Bacall What is this "HA" standing for? "AH", what is this?

Interviewer 1068.

Lauren Bacall On this rug. "HR".

Sandra McGrath Isn't it all night long? You're on the air.

Interviewer You know what the maid has done? She has not made the bed for about two weeks.

Lauren Bacall When they moved the television...

Interviewer Yeah, sure, which reminds me, I should check that.

Lauren Bacall They didn't move the, you mean move the refrigerator?

Interviewer Oh, the refrigerator. She said television.

Lauren Bacall Oh, which reminds me, they should check Sans. It's not working properly.

Sandra McGrath Did that have the radio on it, James?

Lauren Bacall Yes, he showed me yesterday. Who can uh we call about that order?

Interviewer I'll do that. Uh, do you just have an order to give? Yeah, because I think he's got to get the stuff. No, it's 250. Yeah, uh, but they've done something with it.

Sandra McGrath Thank you. See you in the car. I'll send up a bra, so you can see if the Silber can.

Lauren Bacall This lemon juice is really wicked.

Sandra McGrath Silver Townhouse, for when you call.

Lauren Bacall Almost dead.

Sandra McGrath Fine, we'll see you there. All the Canberra people pick me up.

Lauren Bacall This is something with the strike.

Sandra McGrath Canberra airport's traffic controllers are on strike.

Lauren Bacall Perth? How are you going to get there? That's a long flight, isn't it?

Sandra McGrath Across the Southern Ocean.

Lauren Bacall Five hours?

Sandra McGrath Yes, four and a little bit. Country is as big as America.

Lauren Bacall I know. Why uh,

Sandra McGrath This is your first trip here, isn't it?

Lauren Bacall Yeah, it's a shame I'm not going to see more of it, but I'm going to just...

Sandra McGrath Yes, dear. I'm going to call Coles right now.

Interviewer Just one cup.

Sandra McGrath Well, most Americans don't like our coffee, because they don't make it good enough. Thank you very much, Happy Mother's Day to you, too.

Lauren Bacall What, what happens? [laughter]

Interviewer You can hand it to her.

Lauren Bacall What do you think is going to happen with the strike?

Interviewer The airways are all right, we're told. They'll be fine Thursday, they're working Friday.

Sandra McGrath Are they working Friday?

Interviewer Really? Well, they said they'd be fine on Friday. Thursday...

Sandra McGrath I'll believe that when I see it, too. [laughter] No, it's quite scary. We've had these petrol strikes once, but this one really seems to be the crunch, doesn't it? And the men...

Lauren Bacall Yeah, but I mean, how can there be a problem tomorrow and not be a problem Friday? That's what I can't understand.

Interviewer Well, it's just a national day, a national strike day, that's what they say.

Sandra McGrath That's why we're putting out the paper today. The paper's a bit tight, because the printers are all off. It will carry, but they're all off.

Lauren Bacall So that means that tomorrow...

Sandra McGrath Might as well wipe it out.

Lauren Bacall ...Sydney is a dead day. I mean, Sydney is a dead city. Everything is closed.

Interviewer All shops will be open, people are going to shop.

Sandra McGrath No, but it does affect the whole city, the stand-downs, and if the buses and trains and cars...

Lauren Bacall The hydrofoil won't be running?

Interviewer No, the ferries... that comes under the ferries.

Lauren Bacall Electricity?

Interviewer Electricity...

Lauren Bacall You're kidding!

Sandra McGrath No, I'm dreading this 3 country-wide strike.

Lauren Bacall My nerves! [laughter] Jesus! Oh, I mean, I have to have light. At least I can read a book. Really? But, but you think there's a possibility about, about uh, about airlines?

Sandra McGrath No, but I mean, you shouldn't worry about it.

Lauren Bacall No, but I mean, you think that it... No, I'm not worried at all about it. But I mean, I, I think there's no way... Maybe by tomorrow we will know more about Friday.

Interviewer Yes, we will, but uh...

Lauren Bacall I mean, I'd hate to get out to the airport and then have it not go. I mean, that would so infuriate me. Oh, no? I should have known. There aren't so many people that are that good with women,

Sandra McGrath right? Not so many at all. No.

Lauren Bacall I did meet John Fowles, though.

Sandra McGrath He's such a shy man.

Lauren Bacall Yeah, very shy man. He's teaching now. I sure like the way he writes. I mean, the one- the wonderful thing that this book has done, of course, is that is I have met some really wonderful writers. I've gotten to know Cheever, who is- I am mad about. I love the way he writes.

Sandra McGrath John Cheever?

Lauren Bacall John Cheever. Are you- are you not familiar with his-

Sandra McGrath Yes, yes, yes. He's wonderful.

Lauren Bacall I met them all up at Knopf: Updike and Barbara Tuchman, Ray Bradbury, Ross Macdonald, Chaim Potok, who's absolutely adorable. Terrific to see them all running around up there.

Sandra McGrath They were fun, actually. Sort of like a stable full of writers.

Lauren Bacall Wonderful.

Sandra McGrath Are you going to write another book? I suppose you've been asked that 50 times.

Lauren Bacall Listen, if- if I can, I- I suppose I'll try someday. I mean, I don't- I wouldn't know now what I would write about is my problem. It's one thing to write about your life, but it's something else-

Sandra McGrath To think about something else.

Lauren Bacall I mean, I don't know. Friends of mine did a very funny thing the day I left for my uh, book tour in England: this large package arrived for me from these friends of mine, with a dozen yellow legal pads and a dozen pens for me to get started on the next one.

Sandra McGrath Oh, no!

Lauren Bacall They said, "Now you've got to get started. Now's to get started."

Sandra McGrath On what is the first question.

Lauren Bacall On what, yeah. I will. I suppose I will try it. I mean, it's in the back of my mind somewhere, I put it back there. It'd be hard to know what to write about. Would have to be based on something that I know, on an incident or something.

Sandra McGrath Fiction, then. I know. Why not write a big film screenplay?

Lauren Bacall Oh, never. I don't want to write a screenplay or play or anything like that. No, I mean, I'd like to try to write a book. But I mean, I don't want to suddenly think I'm a writer. My writer friends wouldn't approve of that, if I suddenly thought I was a writer. They'd look at me cross-eyed.

Speaker 3 You could always go to Chad.

Lauren Bacall Oh, I don't think I'm going to do that. That's been done. Oh, no. No, I'm going to do my own thing, whatever it is. Yeah, well, I've got to live it live it first. By the time I finish living it, I'm not sure I'll be able to even hold a pen! You know? What's the date? 20th? 20th of June. Tomorrow's the first day of summer where I come from.

Sandra McGrath Shortest day of the year here. Shortest day of the year here.

Lauren Bacall So funny to be, have winter in June, isn't it?

Sandra McGrath The weird part is when it's December, when it's December and it's hot, that is weird.

Speaker 3 And you're on the beach in the burning sun, trying to eat roast turkey.

Lauren Bacall Well, you know, but you know, that's what it was, it was in California. That was the first thing that hit me when I went to California. I could not believe the sun and the swimming in December and January, and the flowers blooming, the palm trees, and the green lawns. I couldn't get over it. It's a terrible shock. When you come from eastern shores, you know.

Sandra McGrath I think your biorhythms take years to adjust. Thank you.

Lauren Bacall Do they?

Sandra McGrath Yeah.

Lauren Bacall Well, I mean, I- I can't imagine how long I'd have to stay here to really get on this- -for my body to get on the right cycle.

Sandra McGrath A lifetime.

Lauren Bacall You've been here for 20 years and you haven't got there yet? Oh. Where did you come from, England?

Sandra McGrath No, from Alabama.

Lauren Bacall From Alabama?!

Sandra McGrath Yes.

Lauren Bacall Do you ever go back?

Sandra McGrath Yes, every two years.

Lauren Bacall Whatever made you come to Australia?

Sandra McGrath I married an Australian.

Lauren Bacall That's a good reason. But Anne Baxter left.

Sandra McGrath I know! I often think about her on that plane.

Lauren Bacall Well, she was in the outback. You weren't in the outback.

Sandra McGrath No. I think if she'd lived in Sydney it might have survived. Sydney is the most beautiful city.

Lauren Bacall It's a lovely city. Yeah, it is.

Sandra McGrath It really is. A great city.

Lauren Bacall Very surprising. I didn't- I had no idea it was as pretty, would be as pretty as it is.

Speaker 3 It really is. I think it's one of the great cities of the world. You can genuinely say that, it really can be accepted.

Lauren Bacall Yeah. I mean, I don't- I don't know what I did expect, but I I mean I expected kangaroos and koala bears, but I kind of thought they'd be all over the place. Shows what an idiot you can be in your life, huh?

Speaker 3 And lots of people. Lots of people. Almost everybody.

Lauren Bacall One has the feeling that Australia, because I knew it was vast, and I had the feeling that it was very wild, and that there was, you know, stretches of land, which is, which is so, but not here.

Sandra McGrath No, all the population is on the coastline, so if you, if you just go 100 miles that way, you'll see instantly the vastness. If you just go to the Blue Mountains and stand on one of those lookouts, you'll see instantly the vastness.

Lauren Bacall Yeah, but where are the Blue Mountains?

Speaker 3 So, if we take her up there tomorrow...

Lauren Bacall Oh, well, we didn't go by there, did we? We we drove to Palm Beach one day.

Speaker 3 No, that's the other way. See, it's- -two and a half, three hour drive.

Sandra McGrath Go up to the Blue Mountains. Oh, it's a monster in a car.

Lauren Bacall Going to Palm Beach in the car was going...

Speaker 3 It's a fair way. See, at Mr Foucart's on Saturday and Sunday... ...for an hour. The road appears to be a long time here, you know, it's so big, it's hard to get to the Blue Mountains. It's 70 miles, it's quite long.

Sandra McGrath Well, ah yes, I agree.

Speaker 3 We'll have a look, possibly, at a helicopter.

Lauren Bacall Helicopter. I like that, helicopter.

Speaker 3 Fly around the Blue Mountains, fly over it. James Stewart was in that struggling group. I have not met him.